diesel engine problems any help appreciated

[hsvking]

firstly g'day folks just joined the site from a Google search,i will be sure to update my profile and stay on your forum.


now,i went off road last week end,hit a water hole which was just a bit to deep

the water was just touching the base of my seats,the car does have a snorkel,and the water wasn't very high in the engine bay,due to the angle i was on, way below the alternator.

now the car stalled in the water,got snatched out,MY WINCH WOULDN'T WORK!! FUMING AT TIGERZ 11!!

with close inspection once out of the water,we notice the fuel did have water in it,so towed home it was.

now we have siphoned drained the tank,replaced the fuel filter,the car ran great for a few days,
now it just died and will not start.
the car has fuel every where it should,though it appears not enough pressure....in the rail

does any one know if the injector pump has a filter also???

is there another filter on board some where else, we done the one in the engine bay.

any other suggestions of what to do??

 

[TigerST]

What type of snorkel

 

[Old.Tony]

Welcome to the forum.

I'm thinking debris in an electrical connection. Let's get a few questions answered first.

1) Do all your dash lights come on as normal when you turn on the ignition?

2) What is the battery voltage if you turn on the ignition and let it sit for 60 seconds (no less)?

3) Does the engine turn smoothly and with "confidence" or does it seem sluggish while starting?

There could be some oxidisation on the battery terminals, earth point to the engine, starter motor terminals. I'd start there. Hopefully the ECM stayed high and dry (driver's side over-guard area back near the firewall beside the brake booster). It's also possible that it's mere coincidence and your battery has decided that it's appropriate to give up the ghost now. Stranger things have happened.

 

[hsvking]

yeah the first battery died in the horrid 4x4 trip lol.

running a new one now,the ECM was dry with all fuses ok,tiny bit of water in the bottom
*** no dash warning lights on at all.

we did have a water in the fuel light on,but i replaced the filter again...and gave her new diesel,and she was fine.

not sure of the brand of the snorkel,but no water in the oil or air box...

just weird how it went ok for a few days then just died....and refuses to start.
that's why i'm thinking if there is another filter that's full of muddy water...

 

[hsvking]

actually there is one light on, the airbag light, but i disconnected the module.

engine turns over as normal, some times we can get her started, but runs like its air locked, but theirs fuel at all places it should be. and remeber this is after we drove it fine for at least 30ks

 

[Old.Tony]

I still think something's become dirty enough (oxidised, whatever you want to call it) to cause the trouble. Now here's the good AND bad news.

BAD: There are 3 different places in the Navara that you'll find fuses and relays and you'll need to visit ALL of them.

* Beside the glove box compartment inside the cabin. I think it's the fuse below the empty spot on the right that controls the instrument cluster. Remove it, check it, reinsert it.

* Behind the ABS unit in the engine bay. Remove and reinsert most everything.

* Behind the battery. Do the same - remove and reinstall.

If you've done any work on the stereo yourself it's possible that the earth for the instrument panel (shared with the stereo) has become unsettled. Earthing the stereo manually (add a wire from chassis to stereo casing) usually settles this down.

GOOD: the above is cheap and might fix it.

Water crossings inevitably introduce fluid of unknown purity into everything, so electrical problems encountered after a swim can usually be fixed by a little mechanical movement of each component.

If it's running poorly it might just have air in the lines. If you can squeeze the primer bulb more than 5-6 times before it's firm there's a chance you have a leak on the suction side of the pump (usually around the filter). This will cause air to enter the line and allow fuel to drain back to the tank, making it seem even harder to start.

If you suspect a leak, check that all hose clamps are positioned correctly and are not under or over tightened. If it's still priming poorly, there's a seal in the filter that has to be positioned perfectly or it just doesn't do its job - seasoned mechanics make that mistake. You might need to pop it open and check it.

 

[hsvking]

Cheers mate will do. Let you know how I go

 

[hsvking]

done all the above today, it looks like there is a sensor preventing the pump to work correctly, or the pump is just stuffed.

we can’t get fuel to the injectors, though we can hand pump the fuel and it goes straight back to the return line,with the injector pump not bringing any to the injectors.
so sadly i'm off to a diesel shop on monday

does any one know much about a joint in seven hills (Sydney) called total care 4wd.

 

[Old.Tony]

I'd hate to think the fuel pump was stuffed - they aren't cheap. They're usually fairly robust, they have had issues with their suction control valves and THIS component might have failed on yours providing similar symptoms.

The question is, has the pump ($4K from Nissan) stopped delivering because it has failed, the SCV ($400 from Nissan) has failed, or the pressure sensor in the rail is not responding properly?

The pressure sensor is NOT a replaceable item according to the manual, which suggests replacing the entire rail (again, expensive - around $4K for the rail from Nissan). However, if it's just the electrical connection from the sensor ... cheap fix, of course.

Still wishing you luck!

 

[Navmania]

I gather you would be able to hear this but would it be possible for something to go wrong with the pumps chain,shaft, or sprocket ? Just a thought.?

 

[hsvking]

The car hasn't gone to the shop as yet.
Once I tried all day Saturday, left it for the night then tried again on Sunday.
Undone the fuel cap to put more diesel in, and heaps of air rushed out of the tank..
so thought I would try again,Then pumped the primer.......she then started & ran for about 4secs then died...(still does now)
Its running on all cylinders & the rail now has fuel at all injectors....
No dash lights on, system seems ok from cluster side of things...

Now I have been bleeding from the fuel filter unscrew cap,the hand pump, undoing the first injector line & also undoing the bolt at the rear of the fuel rail...
Seems I may have an air lock from the pump line???
Any more tips on bleeding the system??

I will change/play around with the rail sensor.
Someone else also said disconnect the valve on the fuel breather line on the tank, and see how it goes.

Atleast it runs now.....for 4secs lol


You guys reckon maybe some water has stuffed the injectors?? Hard to believe that when it didn't really go that far with contaminated fuel. their was little bits of creek water/mud in my old filter tho....

I will try again this weekend if no luck, I might try find a mobile diesel mechanic see if they can see the problem.

 

[Navmania]

Did the air rush out or suck in. If the breather is blocked it will vacuum the tank. I'm not sure how the pump would react once the tank was to its limit of vacuum. Try starting it up with the fuel cap off. I have also read in other threads that the fuel rail pressure sensor can't be replaced you have to change the complete rail. Big bucks to. Old Tony can shed more light on that one.

Cheers.

 

[hsvking]

yeah well i'm not 100% sure if the air came out or went in lol, but it was a lot of air.

 

[Navmania]

Try start it with the fuel cap off. Maybe prime it first tho, still with the cap of.

 

[Old.Tony]

I'd give it a go with the cap off, reprime and go. Don't worry about bleeding the system, the fuel pump actually runs through the entire tank contents in about 5 minutes - it's a friggin' demon. Air bubbles will get hauled through fairly quickly.

If air is finding its way back in easily (highly possible) you might experience lots of starting trouble because of the amount of air in the line. An overtightened hose clamp will pinch the hose, creating a leak. Undertightened is obvious. Inside the fuel filter is a small seal that has to sit perfectly, and if it doesn't the filter will allow air to enter.

I'm concerned about the air rushing into/out of the tank. It's something you see in petrol tanks when there's been a significant change in temperature and the cap vent isn't 100%.

If you have a small leak in the fuel line (this is all on the suction side so you'll never see a spray of fuel from it), it's possible for the tank to have vacuum from a blocked vent and then the pump stops drawing from the tank because it's getting air from the leak, but without that leak, the pump is fairly strong and ought to pull fairly strongly from the tank.

Another thought - if there's a large vacuum in the tank, or even high pressure, there can't be a large leak in the fuel line because the tank will balance itself through that leak.

I'd start with removing the cap, reprime and see what happens.

 

[Leprechaun]

You need to get it to a diesel mech, dont throw away money guessing the problem. Fuel sensors can be replaced without replacing the whole rail!

 

[hsvking]

Cheers for the responses the more ideas the better.
I haven't checked that seal on the fuel filter yet...where is it located??

Flat out with work commitments till Saturday, luckily I have 2 cars.
Will give it a crack this weekend.

 

[Navmania]

Hope is a cheap fix for ha mate. Let us know how it goes.

 

[70degrees]

In response to your question regarding Total Care Seven Hills...yes I would recommend them not the cheapest place around but the owner (forget his name) know's his diesels!

Have you hooked diagnostics up to it? Maybe reading the fuel rail pressures etc..would give you a few hints???

 

[Old.Tony]

The seal (an o-ring) is inside. P15 of the FL.PDF part of the manual, component 3. It sits at the base of the filter.