Diff Locks
- Thread starter 04HUG
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the front is not always that good mate, remember the Pathfinder on Monkey Gum? i mention it below and what happened to him.
Thats i do mate and im both D40 driver and a Ranger owner, i explain why below.
I will just speak from my own personal experience with using traction control and rear E-locker, as i have no PERSONAL experience with my vehicle only having a front locker i wont try and guess or spout my opinion as we seem to have loads of them already in this thread.
First of all Traction control, after owning two D40's one with it and one with out it i can honestly say the difference if used correctly is amazing!! the two cars were like chalk and cheese despite having the same lift including brand and running the same shoes.
The stuff it allowed me to climb and cross compared to not having it was unbelievable you would not of thought it was even the same type of ute it was ALMOST like having lockers, i did say almost!
The problem with it is that the system needs time to think and activate so your momentum is lost, once it figures out what wheel needs the brake applied and allows the other wheel to then work it generally will climb out.
04HUG the VDC (vehicle dynamic control) IS NOT ABLS (active brake limited slip) or as we are calling it traction control so you loose very little power when the ABLS is active you will loose power with the VDC but that is what it is supposed to do in order to keep the car from spinning out .
Rear E-Locker, after now using it in the Ranger and seeing Jayson from this forum using a ARB air locker in the rear his D40 i highly recommend one, not only at the flick of a switch will it allow you to get through most of what you throw at it but it can be used in other areas.
1) towing on(boat ramp) and off road, up or down hills it has it benefits.
2) you can still use it in 2wd, try doing that with just the front, dont get me wrong the front locker would be nice and before seeing for my self what the rear is like on its own i two thought the front would be so much better, but now after using it the rear is very good and gets me where i want to go to the point im not actually worried about spending the coin on a front.
3) while its on i still have 100% of my turning circle and steering remains constant.
sometimes in really slippery conditions on tight bends the front locked can pull you across the turn rather the allowing you to steer around it as OneMofo and i saw first hand on the Monkey Gum Trail where a Pathfinder with a LOKKA near rolled over and ended up sliding into a massive wash out that was around shoulder hight and needed all sort of work and winches to get him out.
4) does awsome circle work!! lol
At the end of the day i think that manufactures like Nissan with the GU patrol and its factory fitted REAR locker and Ford with the factory fitted REAR E locker and Mitsubishi's Triton and its Factory REAR locker do it for a reason as its the most friendly to use and keeps the car feeling pretty much normal while being operated with it active and the difference between only a front and only a rear must be minimal so they opt for the one that has most benefits as a whole.
After owning and using the rear locker only i would go for that now if i only had the coin for one.
I have never owned a 4wd with computer controlled traction control, don't ever want to
but I drove a work car (patrol) with front and rear air lokkas all over the gulf country for years, they do work well when used properly and are a necessity up there
we also had a hilux with a rear air locker in the fleet
I owned an FJ55 years ago and it was twin air locked
I do have plenty of PERSONAL experience with lokkas both air and e lokkas and my preference is the e lokka
I have also seen these so called traction control cars get cross locked, what then, oh hang on that's not PERSONAL experience, so I better shut up
but I drove a work car (patrol) with front and rear air lokkas all over the gulf country for years, they do work well when used properly and are a necessity up there
we also had a hilux with a rear air locker in the fleet
I owned an FJ55 years ago and it was twin air locked
I do have plenty of PERSONAL experience with lokkas both air and e lokkas and my preference is the e lokka
I have also seen these so called traction control cars get cross locked, what then, oh hang on that's not PERSONAL experience, so I better shut up
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I have never owned a 4wd with computer controlled traction control, don't ever want to
I have also seen these so called traction control cars get cross locked, what then, oh hang on that's not PERSONAL experience, so I better shut up
well it wasnt working properly or the driver didnt let it do its thing.
Ive seen twin locked stuff get stuck to doesnt mean i know it all and doesnt mean its no good and i wouldnt put it on my car.
happy john
Member
I have seen 40's with traction control do hard stuff only to end up on it's belly. From what I see most pick the wrong line or don't know how to drive at all. EG twin locked cruiser I pulled up Indian Head at Fraser.80k on that car and he drove like a fool. 27k old 22 went over 3 times with a good driver and all I got was a 6 pack lol.
Nevyn
Member
I would like to add that picking the right line whether locked or not is gonna get you more places than not!! Sometimes it's only s matter of inches.
Locked and ready for Muster, Brad
Locked and ready for Muster, Brad
75 GRC
Member
Yes Brad I agree with that,
Picking the right line is most important.
And once you have accepted the challenge keep momentum up. They are the 2 critical factors.
Wheel placement and Momentum.
Cheers Geoff Go the V-6's
Picking the right line is most important.
And once you have accepted the challenge keep momentum up. They are the 2 critical factors.
Wheel placement and Momentum.
Cheers Geoff Go the V-6's
I don't have lockers yet. But I've read, and watched, and listened. Plus I've learned a bit about traction and delivering it.
Auto locker? Not for me, I want to control when it engages.
Why lock the front first? Being the weaker diff, the locker will protect it. Here's how. When you lift a front wheel (unlocked) the lifted wheel spins like mad. As it touches down and gets some bite, the energy (momentum) in the wheel has to dissipate somewhere. A little will be lost to flicking stones, some will be lost in heat and deposited rubber. Most of it is transferred into the drive train. This will either push the car forward, or cause something to break - and our front diffs (and CVs) don't stand up to this strain too often.
If locked, a lifted front wheel is governed by the rotation of the other front wheel - so there's NO risk of damage to the drive train.
If the rear starts to spin - yes, I've lifted a rear wheel like most of us have - you pull the handbrake up a little, the spinning wheel slows and the LSD starts to transfer power to the stationary wheel. So front locker + handbrake will get you out of more situations.
Fully locked? Damn, that's the way to go. Watched a fully locked car just casually crawl its way up a steep climb metres away from the back of our caravan at the last muster. This was followed by 3 unlocked cars that attempted - and failed - to climb the same hill, at varying speeds from "careful" to "holy $hit he's going to fall off the hill if he keeps that up".
Auto locker? Not for me, I want to control when it engages.
Why lock the front first? Being the weaker diff, the locker will protect it. Here's how. When you lift a front wheel (unlocked) the lifted wheel spins like mad. As it touches down and gets some bite, the energy (momentum) in the wheel has to dissipate somewhere. A little will be lost to flicking stones, some will be lost in heat and deposited rubber. Most of it is transferred into the drive train. This will either push the car forward, or cause something to break - and our front diffs (and CVs) don't stand up to this strain too often.
If locked, a lifted front wheel is governed by the rotation of the other front wheel - so there's NO risk of damage to the drive train.
If the rear starts to spin - yes, I've lifted a rear wheel like most of us have - you pull the handbrake up a little, the spinning wheel slows and the LSD starts to transfer power to the stationary wheel. So front locker + handbrake will get you out of more situations.
Fully locked? Damn, that's the way to go. Watched a fully locked car just casually crawl its way up a steep climb metres away from the back of our caravan at the last muster. This was followed by 3 unlocked cars that attempted - and failed - to climb the same hill, at varying speeds from "careful" to "holy $hit he's going to fall off the hill if he keeps that up".
you get the same effect with the rear locker, as soon as i flick the switch in 99% of situations i can crawl up regardless what wheel is in the air.
you guys are all talking like the rear locker hardly works and the only way to go is the front, from my experience this is not the case.
Tony you say "If locked, a lifted front wheel is governed by the rotation of the other front wheel - so there's NO risk of damage to the drive train.
this is not true mate, yes you will limit the chances of failure but not in all cases or situations, ive seen locked front ends and have read plenty plenty of stories even here on this forum where locked cars are destroying all sorts of driveline parts.
the sheer load can snap a cv not just the rotational force generated from hitting the ground while spinning, if you load up the drive line on say a rock step or shelf with tonnes of grip then try and drive up it then that too can be excessive force and BANG.
when i snapped both of my front diffs in my D40 neither time was the wheels in the air, both times it was from load alone.
you guys are all talking like the rear locker hardly works and the only way to go is the front, from my experience this is not the case.
Tony you say "If locked, a lifted front wheel is governed by the rotation of the other front wheel - so there's NO risk of damage to the drive train.
this is not true mate, yes you will limit the chances of failure but not in all cases or situations, ive seen locked front ends and have read plenty plenty of stories even here on this forum where locked cars are destroying all sorts of driveline parts.
the sheer load can snap a cv not just the rotational force generated from hitting the ground while spinning, if you load up the drive line on say a rock step or shelf with tonnes of grip then try and drive up it then that too can be excessive force and BANG.
when i snapped both of my front diffs in my D40 neither time was the wheels in the air, both times it was from load alone.
You're right - I should have said "vastly reduced risk of damage". If there's no momentum in the lifted wheel, there's no energy to expend when it contacts the ground. That's a frequent cause of damage - that doesn't exist if the front end is locked.
There are alway other ways to destroy drive trains though!
There are alway other ways to destroy drive trains though!
Still a wheel can still be lifted with a locker and therefore still come down in the same way spinning and do the same damage, in allot of cases yes your need for the extra right foot is reduced but in no way removed altogether, even with a locker you may in some condition require momentum and it is still common for the wheel in the air and on the ground to be spinning and again put the car in the same position as it would be with out a locker and hit the ground with a spinning wheel.
The main reason for less damage is the fact that you remove the week components in the centre of the diff, in the 4cyl D40 when you put a E-locker in you remove the 2 pinion set for a 4 pinion set so that in it self is the added bonus and strength.
The main reason for less damage is the fact that you remove the week components in the centre of the diff, in the 4cyl D40 when you put a E-locker in you remove the 2 pinion set for a 4 pinion set so that in it self is the added bonus and strength.
siringo
Member
When speaking of LSD rear ends, I haven't looked into it, but I'm pretty sure the D22 and the D40 have different diffs.
My rear end (D40) with the factory LSD couldn't move me off my wet naturestrip, it was absolutely useless.
If my Nav didn't have that weak front diff, I wouldn't have bothered with a locker in the front.
If I had only enough money to by one locker, it'd be a rear locker.
My rear end (D40) with the factory LSD couldn't move me off my wet naturestrip, it was absolutely useless.
If my Nav didn't have that weak front diff, I wouldn't have bothered with a locker in the front.
If I had only enough money to by one locker, it'd be a rear locker.
from what i gather its the same as the current D40 and uses the same ABLS (traction control) system
Hahaha if Nissan were smart, if pigs could fly. I'd be surprised if the D23 even came Locked like its competitors.
Sunny Coaster
Member
Going to be buying a 4wd systems front lokka soon, has any1 installed 1 themselves....?
Sunny Coaster
Member
its a D22, the guy at 4ed systems sent through the how to guide but still something you want to get right..... 500 for some1 to install it seems a bit steep
Of u can take the diff out yourself OP in Penrith will do it for around $250 and that's with a new bearing. Your local OP should be able to match that. Where u located??
Pretty sure the write up was for a D22.
Pretty sure the write up was for a D22.
