CarlJT
Member
Tyre wear is fine. Alignment has been checked and redone to help with issues. They're pretty new so very little wear. Last pair rear lasted really well even wear. Always had issues with front inside wear however.
LSD rebuild?
- Thread starter CarlJT
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Tyre wear is fine. Alignment has been checked and redone to help with issues. They're pretty new so very little wear. Last pair rear lasted really well even wear. Always had issues with front inside wear however.
CarlJT
Member
Leave it and have fun geeeez I'd kill for a tight diff pack
Swaps? I've got a 3 year old, can't have fun anymore when he's in car
CarlJT
Member
I don't think it's due to steering style. Have always driven the same style. issue is new driving style sameLike oversteer understeer vid Izzi. I think the Nascar boys have the best explanation. Oversteer is when you don't see what your going to hit. Understeer is when you do see what going to hit. Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall and Torque is how far you go into the wall.
Sounds like conditions more so than diff, as surely spinning out under normal driving conditions would be unusual even with a standard open diff? Toyota lsd's are that crappy you basically have an open diff anyway after they've done 10 thou lol and they don't spin out everywhere.
LSD are generally good on navs, but they do let go and once a wheel spins are basically an open diff. Also the standard AT's are a compromise and not especially good at anything IMO. So if conditions allow this to happen, it will happen even with LSD.
I know of back country roads steep enough and loose enough surface that cars with even good LSD struggle in 2wd because eventually one wheel starts spinning. I can usually make it unless I stop for some reason and try to take off again. This is where good traction control seems a better idea.
Generally if your car lets go around a corner you've either got crappy tyres or you're not driving to the conditions.
LSD are generally good on navs, but they do let go and once a wheel spins are basically an open diff. Also the standard AT's are a compromise and not especially good at anything IMO. So if conditions allow this to happen, it will happen even with LSD.
I know of back country roads steep enough and loose enough surface that cars with even good LSD struggle in 2wd because eventually one wheel starts spinning. I can usually make it unless I stop for some reason and try to take off again. This is where good traction control seems a better idea.
Generally if your car lets go around a corner you've either got crappy tyres or you're not driving to the conditions.
There's an issue (in the YD25 cars at least) with a lack of adjustment of the steering/suspension gear. Not enough eccentric bolts to allow for proper camber adjustment, I believe (will have to go ask the local tyre guy again). I took my car to Pedders at Beresfield who said they could buy and fit the correct stuff (there was considerable discussion about the issue, and they assured me they knew what to get and fit to fix it), they didn't - they just put brand new same-shit-as-factory in and then spent a couple of hours trying to adjust it when they couldn't because the factory suspension can't be.
I'll have to try again, but source the stuff myself and have my local guys fit it, because a specialist suspension place like Pedders is obviously incapable of doing it.
Been a while
Member
It's the staff, not the name, what Pedders shop?
Like most supermarket auto shops, they do have a problem with hiring twats that think they know more than they do, about the same ilk of the supercheap Noody telling other noodys to lubricate thier fan belts with crc....
But yeahhh, it's not the name, it's the precious little "know it alls" they hire! You knowwww the type ... The ones that make your skin crawl just looking at them....
What's the name the kids give "those type of men" again- twigboys or something, kids huh, funny little mights they are eh ....
........
Try adding weight to the bed, and new boots on the rear! Ask a mate to swap the rears for a day, you know, try the simple stuff.... Don't go over thinking it, or next thing you'll know you'll be buying 5lt of CRC
Like most supermarket auto shops, they do have a problem with hiring twats that think they know more than they do, about the same ilk of the supercheap Noody telling other noodys to lubricate thier fan belts with crc
....But yeahhh, it's not the name, it's the precious little "know it alls" they hire! You knowwww the type ... The ones that make your skin crawl just looking at them....
What's the name the kids give "those type of men" again- twigboys or something, kids huh, funny little mights they are eh ....
........
Try adding weight to the bed, and new boots on the rear! Ask a mate to swap the rears for a day, you know, try the simple stuff.... Don't go over thinking it, or next thing you'll know you'll be buying 5lt of CRC
Been a while, it's obviously been a while since you checked your facts. Before you keep on poking fun at someone who mentioned using CRC in relation to a drive belt you should be aware that CRC make a specific product called Belt Dressing that they say " Extends belt life by improving traction and reducing belt tension, slipping and dirt or product debris build-up. Annoying squeaks and squeals will be eliminated..."Or you could gather the great intellectual minds of the group and see what they say about filling the diff up with CRC .. Might get her moving lol
Have fun ...
And nooo , you don't fill your diff with CRC, no matter what Mr CRC says! Sure he has his uses, but not here, not todayyyyyy lol not ever .... Don't get me wrong, Mr OL' CRC does have her uses, but not here... Although "some" say it does stop fan belt squeal eh
haven't tried it myself...
You can see it at CRC Food Grade Belt Dressing 284g
Been a while
Member
Yeahhhh but that's not what Mr CRC used now is it champ... nawww it's ok, I understand sticking up for your girlfriends... a little bullish in your ways there champ, but hey, who am I to argue with the intellectuals of the group...
CRC rules, baby! I just used it on my wiper blades, works a treat...
CRC rules, baby!
I just used it on my wiper blades, works a treat...Found quite the opposite actually. Not such a big deal in dry conditions on tar, but particularly on dirt or in the wet. Putting the foot down out of a corner with an open diff, once a tyre breaks traction it gets all the drive and they spin out easily ie. the less traction a wheel has the more drive it gets. A LSD should limit this, it will let go too eventually, but not as easily. It will allow differential action while also sending power to both wheels (up to a point). Thought that was the whole point of LSD's?
Have always noticed that taking off/ turning at intersections from stopped the nav is likely to squeal a tyre. Thats certainly not from power lol, it's from the diff trying keeping the wheels (which are actually covering different distances) at the same speed afaik. Seems they allow differential action (allowing wheels to turn at different rates) better at higher speeds.
Could be wrong of course.
joe2006
Member
IMO a proper LSD can be quite scary around corners as it will want to straighten up and they have a predisposition to fishtail.
The Nav "LSD" could do no such thing.
The Nav "LSD" could do no such thing.
that sounds like a bad lsd thats grabbing, possibly from excessive preload or using non-lsd oil.
lsd slips to allow cornering and should be smooth.
drive one with a torsen lsd diff, they are very smooth and provide far better traction than a clutch lsd.
joe2006
Member
I have 2 vehicles with Ford 9", both with friction modifier. I had new clutch packs in both at different times. Normal cornering is fine but if trying to induce wheel spin, they will oversteer. Transferring power from one wheel to the other results in fishtailing so need to be careful, particularly in the wet.
Not ideal but the Nav LSD seems to be particularly insipid.
[email protected]
Member
"Young blokes who cant do anything without U tubing it.It's the staff, not the name, what Pedders shop?
Like most supermarket auto shops, they do have a problem with hiring twats that think they know more than they do, about the same ilk of the supercheap Noody telling other noodys to lubricate thier fan belts with crc
But yeahhh, it's not the name, it's the precious little "know it alls" they hire! You knowwww the type ... The ones that make your skin crawl just looking at them....
What's the name the kids give "those type of men" again- twigboys or something, kids huh, funny little mights they are eh ....
........
Try adding weight to the bed, and new boots on the rear! Ask a mate to swap the rears for a day, you know, try the simple stuff.... Don't go over thinking it, or next thing you'll know you'll be buying 5lt of CRC
Got to make you wonder why engineers go to so much trouble and expense to design and put LSD's in their cars, just to make them more difficult to steer around corners...lol.
If you're fishtailing because the tyres lose traction that sounds like the tyres (and possibly suspension) are past their limits and if your aim is to intentionally "induce wheel spin" around corners, basic physics dictates that any car is probably going to fishtail.
But if the diff is really causing strange things to happen around corners it either isn't set up properly, or is possibly just not very well designed (always a fair assumption if designed by ford lol).
The nav's aren't racing cars and the LSD's have their limits, but I think the LSD's are one of the better ones you'll find in these particular type of cars. Toyota might be one of the worst.
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Jardsoooo
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Well I would have thought an LSD is about straight line traction as in a compromise between and open diff and a locker.
Seems intuitive to me that two wheels on opposite ends of an axle, trying to go round a corner while being encouraged to prescribe the same arc is going to produce oversteer when pushed.
The whole idea of a differential is to drive the wheels, but in a way that allows them to turn at different speeds when going around corners. An LSD is designed to allow this to happen in a certain way and not really a compromise between anything and a locker, as lockers are designed to stop this type of differential action entirely.
One problematic side effect of diffs is that force will be distributed more to the wheel with the least resistance, so if a wheel loses traction and spins, generally the revs increase and the wheel will further spin like a mofo (while the wheel with traction is basically just being dragged along by the momentum of the vehicle).
A "limited slip" diff is simply an effort to overcome this otherwise negative side effect of differential action. It could be a problem with "straight line traction" in certain conditions, but far more likely to be a problem when cornering. A LSD will still let the wheels rotate at different speeds allowing for smooth cornering if it is working properly, but it will help minimise the effect described above. If it's working in any way like a locker or causing problems in highway conditions it is defeating the very purpose of having one to begin with and there is something wrong with it.
Here's a little tidbit that (afaik) is true concerning open diffs, while relevant to this discussion is probably more relevant to off roading.
Under normal conditions the drive/torque to the wheels is split 50/50 via the diff. When you hit a "wombat hole" or for some reason get a front and rear wheel both spinning, the drive is sent 100% (or close to it for practical purposes) to the wheel(s) with no traction. So not only do the engine revs increase suddenly by having no resistance at the wheels, but the diff will then turn the spinning wheel(s) at double the speed they normally would be as well (assuming your forward momentum has stopped at this point).
Then when you do gain traction again it puts an awful strain on things like cv joints. Another benefit of lockers is they stop this. Even having only one locker (either rear or front) will generally stop the motor revving its guts out when you lift wheels.
This will also be relevant to some extent (although much less) to cornering when a wheel starts spinning on the highway. Back in the day open diffs were generally considered good fun to hoon in because the rear let go so easily lol.
Under normal conditions the drive/torque to the wheels is split 50/50 via the diff. When you hit a "wombat hole" or for some reason get a front and rear wheel both spinning, the drive is sent 100% (or close to it for practical purposes) to the wheel(s) with no traction. So not only do the engine revs increase suddenly by having no resistance at the wheels, but the diff will then turn the spinning wheel(s) at double the speed they normally would be as well (assuming your forward momentum has stopped at this point).
Then when you do gain traction again it puts an awful strain on things like cv joints. Another benefit of lockers is they stop this. Even having only one locker (either rear or front) will generally stop the motor revving its guts out when you lift wheels.
This will also be relevant to some extent (although much less) to cornering when a wheel starts spinning on the highway. Back in the day open diffs were generally considered good fun to hoon in because the rear let go so easily lol.
what type lsd?
the basic ones like nav's are basically "locked" and its the utes turning action that forces the wheels to turn at different speed and also overpower the clutch in the lsd. but put enough power down and it will act like an open diff. common trick is to pre load the clutch pack tight so it requires more force before the clutch slips. but then if its a wet road you can't get enough grip to force the wheels to do different speeds. one wheel will slide on the road and the diff will stay "locked".
if you have big 9" diff with low HP and low traction tires, that could happen.
also some types of lsd will make the clutch lock harder when you put the boot into it.
