Adam
Its a long shot at best & I don't like your chances, I think somebody has tried it once before but it didn't get off the ground
regards
Rod
Engine Dramas
- Thread starter yogi351
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Adam
Its a long shot at best & I don't like your chances, I think somebody has tried it once before but it didn't get off the ground
regards
Rod
benchrisfennell
Member
What sort of yr range of 2.5 litres are we looking at. Is it just the older d40"s. Is it just the Spain ones or mixture of both? Interested to know
happy john
Member
Seems to be 6 of one and half a dozen of the other from what I read on various forums mate.
benchrisfennell
Member
Rodger. Ever nav onwer i know still have never had dramas with there navs me included and they range from yr model to d22/and d40
The timing chain failures mostly seem to be from SOME of the D40s. Despite it being nearly the same engine in the 2.5L STR D22, I've heard/read very few reports of any major problems with the D22.
In reality it's not a large percentage of shipped cars that have the failures. It's difficult to pick why it's happened - that's one of the reasons I started that poll on the choice of oil filter in relation to timing chain failures. That proved to be a mixed bag as well - some reporting that aftermarket filters have caused no concerns, others reporting failures with genuine filters only so while it's not conclusive, it does make me personally lean towards exclusively using genuine filters ... but I digress.
The Renault-designed 2.5L engine is quite robust except for the possibility of the timing chain going. I can't imagine why they didn't use HyVo chains in there - my 1977 CB900 had a bloody HyVo chain driving the camshafts.
I've heard of complaints about the injectors - not many, but some - and they're bloody expensive from the dealer but much cheaper if you buy them aftermarket (I think Baileys Diesel Group do a great deal on them). You have to replace the spill pipe gaskets at a minimum, Nissan will advise you to replace the high pressure pipes as well (which might be a good idea if there's any sign of damage on these).
The SCV is not so much a failure point but it gets dirty - and that makes me wonder three things. First, how does the dirt get past the filter, and second - why was the SCV designed so that it could be interfered with by debris? And, is there a way to improve that? Don't know, and Nissan obviously won't be doing much about the YD25 as they've already moved on.
Other than those faults - you can't really knock the engine itself. It puts out a fair amount of power and torque for its size - although the new NP300 powerplant, despite being smaller, gives it a good run for its money. Speaking of which, I wonder how far you could take the 2.3L engine out in terms of HP/T by changing turbos, intercooler(s), water/alcohol/gas injection etc etc. The YD25 gets quite a bootful - one member here has increased the output of his YD25 from 96kW to over 150kW. Will we see 50%+ gains possible from the NP300?
In reality it's not a large percentage of shipped cars that have the failures. It's difficult to pick why it's happened - that's one of the reasons I started that poll on the choice of oil filter in relation to timing chain failures. That proved to be a mixed bag as well - some reporting that aftermarket filters have caused no concerns, others reporting failures with genuine filters only so while it's not conclusive, it does make me personally lean towards exclusively using genuine filters ... but I digress.
The Renault-designed 2.5L engine is quite robust except for the possibility of the timing chain going. I can't imagine why they didn't use HyVo chains in there - my 1977 CB900 had a bloody HyVo chain driving the camshafts.
I've heard of complaints about the injectors - not many, but some - and they're bloody expensive from the dealer but much cheaper if you buy them aftermarket (I think Baileys Diesel Group do a great deal on them). You have to replace the spill pipe gaskets at a minimum, Nissan will advise you to replace the high pressure pipes as well (which might be a good idea if there's any sign of damage on these).
The SCV is not so much a failure point but it gets dirty - and that makes me wonder three things. First, how does the dirt get past the filter, and second - why was the SCV designed so that it could be interfered with by debris? And, is there a way to improve that? Don't know, and Nissan obviously won't be doing much about the YD25 as they've already moved on.
Other than those faults - you can't really knock the engine itself. It puts out a fair amount of power and torque for its size - although the new NP300 powerplant, despite being smaller, gives it a good run for its money. Speaking of which, I wonder how far you could take the 2.3L engine out in terms of HP/T by changing turbos, intercooler(s), water/alcohol/gas injection etc etc. The YD25 gets quite a bootful - one member here has increased the output of his YD25 from 96kW to over 150kW. Will we see 50%+ gains possible from the NP300?
they did that with the non-cr yd25 d22 in the uk with the conrod though the block problem.
the outcome was nissan extended the warranty a few more years.
benchrisfennell
Member
Good read mate.
I love my d40 its my first brand new car. I service it on time. Only use genuine parts and filter and i drive it like a deisel. I hope it lasts me and if the prob came about and i had to do a chain so be i will. �� Go the Nissans
fatman
Member
150kw is piss weak. I feel sorry for this bloke whose engine ate itself...I hope he finds a new motor cheap.
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For a ute in this class, where the nearest factory competitor is 147kW (Mazda BT50), it's a respectable output. Sure, it's no V8 Supercar, but I doubt Lowndes would ever want 500Kg of chicken manure in the back of his race car, nor would he even consider towing a 2.5T caravan around Winton. And further, I'd never consider driving my ute at 300km/h on public roads - or off-road.
And before anyone jumps on the "but Land Cruisers have more power", I challenge you to put 500Kg of chicken manure in the back and drive it around (without breathing apparatus). Same for the Patrol. The Navara is a ute, it's multipurpose, and does some things much better than others and in order to do that there are compromises that MUST be made.
Prime example: the D40 ramp-over "issue". You do NOT get a cabin that large, or the stability on the road, without putting some distance between the front and rear wheels. If people wanted a rock crawler, they'd buy a Sierra and throw 37s on it. But a Sierra would struggle towing a 500Kg trailer, let alone carrying that much stink in the back.
Horses for courses. WE all chose to buy a utility vehicle that has a separate cargo space behind the cabin, with the compromises that come with it. We all chose to buy Nissans, of whatever model or engine type. Every manufacturer has particular and specific issues with their vehicles - the ONE thing you can say about the outcome of this thread is that we are all very aware of the major issues that might affect our choice in vehicle, and we can prepare for it.
I also hope a new/replacement engine can be sourced relatively cheaply and easily. I wonder if BM Higginbottom does them? They have a long-standing reputation for producing good reco engines.
benchrisfennell
Member
I would love to know an excat number of d40 failures and the number of d40's shipped to Australia....... You will only ever hear of the failures on a forum because its the place were people come for answers..... No doubt the good and reliable number of d40's far out weight the bad..
fatman
Member
I believe his name is Mannnick, nice ute, I'd worry about the long term strength of his set up though. He's only running 33s as far as I can tell.
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fatman
Member
I think that Nissan are pricks for moving manufacturing to 3rd world countrys to save money, all the new Utes are weak, not just Nissan, French engines are a big question mark also.
Black_Outlaw
Member
Fortunately for me, I was chasing another issue that was thought to be timing chain related (turned out not to be - but that's another story).. 2008 D40, Automatic.. 190K on the clock.. When we removed the timing chain cover, well lets just say It was a good thing as far as misdiagnosis is concerned.. It was quite literally on its last legs.. Full dealer service history and all..
They are of poor design and definitely NOT for LIFE OF ENGINE - unless that engine life is dated by how long the chain survives...
So far its had 2 x BOOST CONTROL SOLENOIDS, 1 x SUCTION CONTROL VALVE, 1 X NEW TIMING CHAIN, Countless hours fixing earthing problems..
One thing for certain, you certainly get to KNOW these engines well....
They are of poor design and definitely NOT for LIFE OF ENGINE - unless that engine life is dated by how long the chain survives...
So far its had 2 x BOOST CONTROL SOLENOIDS, 1 x SUCTION CONTROL VALVE, 1 X NEW TIMING CHAIN, Countless hours fixing earthing problems..
One thing for certain, you certainly get to KNOW these engines well....
Whoever told you this is either:
A stoner on a trip.
A 14yo that had a grip on himself but nothing else.
Someone with deep pockets and access to lots of replacement parts and builds them to run 1/4 mile at a time.
NO WAY is that possible with any reliability from a YD25.
180Hp is 134kW. I'm sure John's pulling over 150kW (201Hp). 180kW is 241Hp and is definitely stretching the friendship with longevity. However, one member here (Bluenavara) is running something like 350Hp (260kW) in his D40. There's a LOT of engineering in that - have a read about it here - that's at least an 85% power increase on the 140kW engine (it's 106% increase on the 126kW version).
The tradeoff there is going to be either (or both, a combination of) engine life or engineering cost. You could beef up conrods, pistons, cams etc - this sort of thing is done all the time in the petrol performance arena, why not in diesels?
The biggest thing (in my mind) stopping people from pouring LARGE amounts of money into diesel performance is that diesel engines just don't rev so we don't think they're producing "power". Our engines are governed at 5000rpm tops and there's a good reason for it. Diesel doesn't burn as fast as petrol, and in order for diesel to have finished its main part of the combustion (assuming injection and ignition at TDC) the combustion has to finish just slightly before BDC - half an engine rotation. At 5,000rpm that's 1/2500th of a minute = 0.024 seconds.
Petrol can burn faster, so engines rev harder and they sound better. A diesel at 5000rpm makes a loud clattering sound. A V8 at 7500rpm makes a sweet, sweet roar. Of course, an alcohol-fuelled engine at 18,000rpm makes a raging whining scream but engines like that (burning fuel that requires no more than 0.0066 of a second to nearly fully combust) produce lots of power and not a lot of torque. It's another tradeoff.
My personal preference is for the lower-revving diesel. I've posted the vid of the Audi R10 doing the LeMans circuit before - it's awesome to see it just leave a rotary-powered Mazda 787B for dead. And those engines are engineered to produce that sort of power for 24 hours straight - so the 5.5 litre V12 engine (with DPF, by the way) which produces its rated 485kW (650Hp) could be run at lower power levels in our Navaras and still keep us whooping with delight. How good is the car? 48 races, 36 wins. By a bloody diesel. With a PAIR of DPFs fitted.
The tradeoff there is going to be either (or both, a combination of) engine life or engineering cost. You could beef up conrods, pistons, cams etc - this sort of thing is done all the time in the petrol performance arena, why not in diesels?
The biggest thing (in my mind) stopping people from pouring LARGE amounts of money into diesel performance is that diesel engines just don't rev so we don't think they're producing "power". Our engines are governed at 5000rpm tops and there's a good reason for it. Diesel doesn't burn as fast as petrol, and in order for diesel to have finished its main part of the combustion (assuming injection and ignition at TDC) the combustion has to finish just slightly before BDC - half an engine rotation. At 5,000rpm that's 1/2500th of a minute = 0.024 seconds.
Petrol can burn faster, so engines rev harder and they sound better. A diesel at 5000rpm makes a loud clattering sound. A V8 at 7500rpm makes a sweet, sweet roar. Of course, an alcohol-fuelled engine at 18,000rpm makes a raging whining scream but engines like that (burning fuel that requires no more than 0.0066 of a second to nearly fully combust) produce lots of power and not a lot of torque. It's another tradeoff.
My personal preference is for the lower-revving diesel. I've posted the vid of the Audi R10 doing the LeMans circuit before - it's awesome to see it just leave a rotary-powered Mazda 787B for dead. And those engines are engineered to produce that sort of power for 24 hours straight - so the 5.5 litre V12 engine (with DPF, by the way) which produces its rated 485kW (650Hp) could be run at lower power levels in our Navaras and still keep us whooping with delight. How good is the car? 48 races, 36 wins. By a bloody diesel. With a PAIR of DPFs fitted.
